Tides of War

The full article can be read at this link...

click here

First of all, the Lusitania event is surrounded by much suspicion. It was the sinking of the Lusitania with 195 Americans aboard, more than any other event, which galvanized American public opinion to favor joining the Great War. The British ?passenger liner? not only carried arms, but also was fully out-fitted for war and was registered as an armed auxiliary cruiser, a contradicting fact that caused the captain of the ship to resign. Our government was aware of this...

Oh, Gawd 'elp us, another "I'm Bashing Britain" campaign.

That issue is pivotal in setting up the Enigma alternate history...

Oh, Gawd 'elp us, another "I'm Bashing Britain" campaign.

We all have skeletons in our national closets. In general, being jingoistic and claiming everything bad that happened is a witch hunt against your nation doesn't help matters.

Er, I'm a Kiwi, and the statement I made was in reference to what I believed to be another example of revisionism in history. Certainly, we all have a tendency to ignore the flaws in our heroes, but that does not give us the right to besmirch their memory.

From Othello:

(Iago to Cassio in Act 2, scene 1, I believe)

?Good name in man and woman?s dear, my lord; Is the immediate jewel of our souls: Who steals my purse, steals trash, ?tis something, nothing, ?Twas mine, ?tis his, and has been slave to thousands: But he that filches from me my good name, Robs me of that which not enriches him, and makes me poor indeed.?

Allow me to add a comment.. I posted this here strictly because I had never read this before and it was not common knowledge to me.. I knew East has developed a storyline where the Lusitania is a pivotal event, and I figured more people like me were out there that didnt know much about the original story.

As for bashing, which I did not believe I was engaging in simply by posting a story I believed to be factual, my intentions were to let the story speak for itself and it is my personal belief to always support our troops and countrymen wherever they may go in harms way, and not to bash them, but to be allowed to bash their leaders for poor decisions that send those soldiers to those destinations unecessarily will always be a god given right we must never lose, and I will defend to the death your right as well as mine to be able to take part in it.

So dont be alarmed by those who bring truth to light, but be vigilant so that those who may have conspired to profit from war are not making the decisions, but are being judged by those who uphold justice for all.

I say if we the british did anything whatsoever to bring america into the 2nd world war then the people on that ship did not die in vain. God knows we would never have won the war on our own.....Dunkirk is a good indicator of that.

I say if we the british did anything whatsoever to bring america into the 2nd world war then the people on that ship did not die in vain.

First world war actually. Japan brought America into the second world war. I'm not 100% but i believe because Germany was in alliance with Japan when USA declared war on Japan Germany declared war on America. could be wrong though.

and on the lusitania. The *myth* surronding the lusitania has been around forever. Its been proven flase.

*please note most of this is from memory of the book Lusitania*

The main reason bhind the lusitania's supposed gun running was the second explosion that occured when the ship was hit with only one torpedeo. This led German sub commander to believe it was carrying weapons. He fired in the first place because the ship was not where it should be (specific shipping lanes for German ships to identify American civilian ships) the captain admitted that he was trying to make up for loss time by cutting across very close to the southern coast of ireland. These 2 factors led to the sinking of lusitania.

When she was explored in the late 1980s the hole left over from the torpedoe was in the forward coal storage. No evidence of weapons were inside (shells etc) but there was no coal either. The ship had used up most of its forward coal in the journey. The torpedoe ignited the dust particles (which are highly flamable) and that caused the second explosion.

I read the link and the bias is easy to see. The truth always has at least two sides (those that corrolate with the two opposing ideologies). I'm very skeptical about information on the internet, especially when articles choose not to list any references that a reader can check on to verify the authienticy of the claim. Anyone can write about anything and make it seem real. I'm not charging that the article is false, but that tone of the writer suggest a deeper agenda than just documenting history.

I've done some internet research before just to see the various causes that the US has gone to war over. Only two wars were a result of being attacked by a foreign military. Those attackes were WWII at Pearl Harbor and the Mexican War when Mexican forces attacked US forces shortly after the US annex of Texas.

The only reason any nation goes to war is to exert its dominance. By doing so, that nation assures it chances of survival. We seldom go to war against those we feel we can't defeat because that might diminishes our chances of survival.

I'm honest enough to know that the Lusitania was not an reason to war, but an excuse, a selling point to win the favor of the public. Germany was but only a competitor to the US, and the US needed a excuse to challenge it. Politicians never believe that brutal honesty will give them a mandate from us to do as they please. They need to present a case to us and persuade us to go along with their war efforts.

To me its not a matter of good or bad behavior. Fundamentally, we do what our genes dictate, survive and continue--replicate your genetic code. We are programmed to be self-centered because that insures that we survive long enough to bear children. I condone the actions of the US because, as a citizen, I benefit from its actions. I have no ill-will against anyone who condones the actions of their own nation, even if they are competitors and despise the US. You are supposed to.

The only issue I have with ERT is that it centers it counter-factual around the sinking of the Lusitania. I believe that it could have been any ship carrying Americans sunk by the Germans that would have lead the US into the Great War. In order for ERT's timeline to be realistic, Germany would have had to not sink any ship with any Americans onboard.

Actuwly from what ive herd it was not the sinking of the Lusitania that led the US to war but acts of sabotarge to us industry as the beleved the us was supplying arms to britan and france, and a redao masage intersepted and decoded by britan which was offring Mexico miltry aid if they attacked the US.